Are Men Too Obsessed With Sports? with Ashley St. Clair





Liz is joined by Ashley St. Clair in an engaging conversation about various cultural and political issues.

Ashley, known for her controversial takes on Twitter and her connection to the Babylon Bee, discusses her opinions on birth control and the need for informed consent. She emphasizes that women should have access to all relevant information before making decisions about birth control due to the potential mental health side effects and the lack of informed consent in some cases. She criticizes the media’s attempts to suppress such discussions and highlights the need for women to be well-informed.

The conversation shifts to politics and appealing to Gen Z voters. Ashley suggests that Gen Z is disillusioned by a system that doesn’t seem to work for them. She believes conservatives can connect with Gen Z by addressing their concerns about a difficult economic landscape, unaffordable housing, and lack of purpose. Ashley expresses that unless these issues are addressed, young people might be inclined to reform or even dismantle the existing system, as seen with Bernie Sanders’ popularity among millennials.

Liz and Ashley also delve into the concept of masculinity and femininity in modern times. They both agree that there’s a crisis in understanding these concepts, and they point out that there’s both an assault on femininity and masculinity. Ashley contends that it’s essential to analyze why figures like Andrew Tate gain traction among men and why society is grappling with these issues.

The interview showcases Ashley’s multifaceted perspective, blending her experiences from traveling, diverse interactions, and studying philosophy. She acknowledges that the lack of role models for men and women today is contributing to the crisis of identity. The conversation concludes with a humorous note, discussing Ashley’s Twitter account and its propensity to spark viral conversations that extend beyond conservative circles into pop culture.

Overall, the interview with Ashley St. Clair reveals her unique viewpoint on birth control, the concerns of Gen Z voters, the crisis of masculinity and femininity, and the impact of her Twitter presence on cultural discussions.

Show Transcript

This transcript was generated automatically and may contain typos, mistakes, and/or incomplete information.

So with me today is a very interesting person. She’s one of the most famous people on Twitter. I don’t think that’s being hyperbolic to say. She also works report, allegedly works for the Babylon Bee, although I’m not sure what she does at the Babylon Bee. it’s Ashley St. Clair. Ashley, what do you do for the Babylon Bee? 

Hey, Liz, I am their diversity hire, so I’m one of the few token women on staff. 

So you are, you serve your role just by sitting there? Just by being? 

Yeah. They they meet their quota for diversity, and I get to put it in my bio. 

Good for Seth. I mean, way to embrace the DEI. 

I’m one of the only ones not paid to be funny, so I do things on the operations side. 

Well, that’s ironic because I think your Twitter account’s one of the most hilarious ones on the internet. You’re also the author of a book called Elephants Are Not Birds, which the Left got very angry at you when you publish this. So what I wanna do today is I tweeted a couple days ago, right after I had texted you and invited you on the show, and we had agreed on a time, which wasn’t easy because we both have toddlers, which means that our schedules almost never match up. and I posted and said, guys, your dreams are coming. True. You know, post your questions for Ashley St. Clair’s joining me on the show this week. And there are some pretty funny questions in here that I want to ask you. The first question is… 

Should I be scared? 

Of some of them? Yes. Of some of them. They’re just funny and entertaining. The first one, it actually, this is not just one. There are multiple questions about your hair, you colored your hair from, you, changed your hair color, I should say, from Brown to blonde. And people are asking why you did that and why you stole my hair. 

I stole your hair. I think yours, yours looks fabulous. I saw Barbie, obviously. And so because it was so, such a feminist movie, it just brainwashed me into dying my hair blonde. but the truth is, I do this about once a year. Usually it’s not this blonde, but I go blonde ish once a year for the past few, few years, except when I was pregnant. So I usually get bored, switch it up, and then I get bored again and go back to brunette because everyone tells me it looks better brunette. but maybe I’ll do something fun diet pink so that everyone loses their minds and then go back to Burnett. 

You can be the new Megan Rapinoe now that she finally retired, and we should hopefully never hear of her again. 

well, hopefully I win more things than her. 

you have a toddler? 

I do 

You have a toddler? I have a toddler. how do you mother, are you a based mother 

You know, I would think so, right? I try to ban baby shark in my house because it’s like hearing demon hymns every morning. The do do, do do, do. But I, you know, I try to limit his screen time. I guess that’s based, and he eats all organic. I don’t know if I’m a crunchy mom for that, if that’s what they call it Now,, 

I think they call it crunch ish. If you also like wear makeup and have a cell phone of your own, like, I identify as a crunch ish mom because on some things I’m like, no, you’re not gonna eat sugar. And on other things I’m like, but I’m definitely going to be wearing, I’m definitely going to be wearing makeup. I’m not gonna be wearing a hemp dress over here. some people say that you’re very controversial on Twitter. N B C News is one of these, is one of these organizations that named you as being con a controversial right wing media personality because of your opinion on birth control. What was so controversial about this? What is your opinion on birth control? 

So there, I believe that women deserve and informed consent when it comes to birth control. What we’re seeing, and my experience personally in many women, millions of women’s experiences is they’re put on the birth control pill at 13, 14 years old for minuscule issues like acne, or they’re put on it for endometriosis, which that works for some people, but many women are not given informed consent about the trade-offs for birth control and the mental health side effects, like the increased risk for suicide and depression. There was a great study done on this recently, a Dutch study, a 2018 Dutch study that was has been circulating. But the issue is they don’t want us to talk about it. And the N B C article really lays this out. They think that if you talk about, and you give women informed consent about birth control, that that’s a net negative because then as many women won’t use birth control, and that’s anti women’s rights. And it’s the most absurd thing I’ve ever seen that women are too stupid to know the actual side effects of birth control. So that’s where that outrage came from them. So 

They’re, they think women shouldn’t be examining science before taking drugs. Well, that sounds really ing to me. That doesn’t sound that I was hoping it would be a little bit more controversial., David Weissman asked a question under my post that says, who does she think would win in the Elon Musk versus Mark Zuckerberg? Match 

Elon, obviously, I hope he clocks Zuckerberg. I hope Zuckerberg goes down as fast as Threads did, which would be pretty quickly. 

It is. I joined Threads because I was like, well, why not? Right? Like, you wanna be where the conversations are. You wanna compete for the minds even on these terrible cultural spaces. But I think I’ve only logged on like five times and it certainly wasn’t past like the first three days. 

It’s a terribly boring platform. It’s terribly boring. 

It’s so boring. It’s like all these weird self-help people. 

It’s like the, and it’s only odd, only tech. You can’t even post videos. I don’t know how people are. And Zuck is doing this weird thing where he is trying to be relatable like Elon and it’s very cringe. 

Yeah. ’cause he is, he’s an alien, right? Or a robot. He’s a 

Wizard person. Wizard. My favorite, my favorite is when he testified in front of Congress and he had the booster seat under him. I don’t know if you remember that, but he testified in front of Congress with a booster seat to make himself look taller. That’s, I don’t know how you recover from that. That’s the most embarrassing thing I’ve ever seen.. 

No, I would probably need to do that. I don’t know how tall you are. I’m five four, but I feel like there’s a, there’s a I don’t know, there’s a justification if you’re a tiny little woman that just doesn’t, doesn’t work. If you’re a, if you’re a man, 

Just embrace it. Short King, embrace it. 

Tony Bennett says, how can conservative candidates win over Gen Z voters? This is actually a good question, and I think, and I know we said we weren’t really gonna talk too much about politics, just about culture stuff, but what happened in Ohio this week where voters rejected the constitutional amendment that would make it harder to change the Constitution. And they the point of the amendment was to make it harder to legalize abortion through all nine months. And Gen Z voters and millennial voters were the ones that really decided that the Left got a whole bunch of young people to turn out and vote against this, or in favor of the abortion rights. Republicans don’t, don’t seem, conservatives don’t seem to compete for Gen Z, but if we were to do that, how would we do it 

To get more Gen Z? There’s, there’s something that Gen Z understands very well, and that’s that the system is not working. And older conservatives and the older generation will see this and they’ll call Gen Z lazy, and they’ll call them dismissive. But this is a generation that understands they’re really gonna own nothing. It’s gonna, they’re not gonna own a home like their parents did, unless they’re incredibly fortunate they’re not gonna be able to buy a car. Car loans. Those interest rates are through the roof right now. It’s incredibly difficult to live and survive on a single income, if not impossible for some people. The prospects of a family are gone, they’re really not living in the same world their parents are. So if, if we don’t give them a solution to this and we don’t address these very real problems, we can’t really blame them for saying, the whole system’s broken. Let’s just reform the whole thing. 

Yeah, it’s almost why, and I guess this was before Gen Z, but why millennials fell for Bernie Sanders because he was just like, this isn’t working. We’ll make this easier for you. And people were like, please make it easier. 

And they increasingly don’t have a sense of purpose, right? I mean, so many are working in this rat race. You have to have two people. You can’t raise your family. You have Joe Biden tweeting out that if we want to compete in the global economy, we’re gonna make childcare more affordable. Nothing sounds worse than going to work and working for this rat race day in and day out, and then having your children raised by a government subsidized stranger. And this is the reality for Gen Z. This is the future they have to look forward to if we don’t make a serious change soon. 

So listen, one of the reasons that I like your Twitter account is because you’re funny and entertaining and you talk about a lot of cultural issues that these, like old dinosaurs of the Republican party don’t, but you also are insightful about topics like this. So what is your story? I mean, you, you really do occupy a pretty unique space that I think is really important, this hybrid between culture and politics. Like what’s your background? 

So I moved around a lot when I was growing up and my mother’s from New York and we grew up some in South Florida, in Montana and Pennsylvania and Colorado and Maryland and New York and all over. So I was really able to garner a lot of different perspectives from a lot of different people in this country. I had to, you know, you go somewhere and I was a social person to an extent. I always call myself like an extroverted introvert. I like talking to people. And then I need my refresh period where I just go in and read books and stay by myself. But I met a lot of people and I talked to a lot of people and a lot of my friends tended to be older people. You know, when we were in Montana, the, my best friend was an 80 year old dude on oxygen. 

There weren’t many people there. So I was able to garner a lot of different perspectives. and I read a lot. I really just immersed myself in different philosophies, different ideas. sociology really interest me a lot. So I think that had a big impact on my ability to see where other people are coming from. I also went to school for philosophy. So I think that really helped no matter how much conservatives wanna mock liberal arts degrees, it really helped me to see things from all perspectives. And I remember when I first went to school for philosophy, I fell in love with it because I had to write a paper for abortion and against abortion. And there were a lot of people who dropped that class because they couldn’t do it because either they were so pro-life that they couldn’t do it, or they were so pro-choice that they couldn’t do it. And I was like, I love this. And I don’t think en enough people consume the materials and the thoughts of people they disagree with, and they don’t know how to dismantle these arguments or really relate to people on a certain level. 

Yeah, that’s interesting. One of the things that I’ve noticed is that the people who actually are independent minded, and I’m not talking about independent, like registered independent, but people who think for themselves or people who’ve read a ton of books, the people who I respect the most when I ask them this question, they almost always a answer that they’ve read a lot of books, which may explain why the Left recognizes this, which is maybe why they have a Marxist lesbian as the president of the American Library Association, because they’ve realized they need to take over the books if they wanna know if they wanna control what’s in children’s minds. who’s the funniest person at the Babylon be? 

Oh, of course. My boss, my boss, Seth Dylan is the funniest person at the Babylon Bay. Please don’t fire me, but no, we I think 


No, I think our editor in chief is really funny. Kyle Mann, our managing editor, Joel Berry. Very funny. I think we have a fantastic creative team. a lot of people don’t know that we do a lot of video as well. We have an awesome YouTube channel. I think everyone collaboratively creates some incredibly incredible work. Our writers are starving writers are also very creative, and they’re all funny in, they’re different ways. Some people have a more dry sense of humor. Some of them are able to relate it to more political issues, theological issues. so I think it just all works really well with everyone together on the team. 

Yeah. Speaking of the videos, I really liked the Californians move to Texas series that you guys did. That was, that was one of the funniest things that you guys have produced. I think that was hilarious. 

It was pretty spot on. I would say it’s spot on. And It was, you know, I’ve been an advocate for a long time. Texas needs to deport all Californians. If you wanna save your great state deport all the Californians, 

I can see why. Okay, so this tweet I found of yours from July 30th. I think this is really interesting, and I wanted to ask you more about this. You said, I’m not traditional enough for conservatives and I’m too traditional for leftists. So I’ve come to the conclusion that I’m just a normal person. di I know this is partially just a funny tweet, but dissect this for me. So when you say you’re not traditional enough for conservatives, what, on what issues do you mean? 

I think there’s a rise, especially, and I just got into a little bit of a Twitter spat today, right? If you speak on any just strictly female issues, men get very emotional about it. And I’m not saying that generally like all men, not all men, right? but there’s this habit on the right lately for men to think anyone who talks about female specific issues, that they’re a feminist, that they shouldn’t do that. Well, what about men? And it’s almost like the roles have been reversed in a way from, you know, women being the damsels in distress in 20 15, 20 16. And it’s almost like now men are doing that saying, you know, what about us? We’re forgotten. And in many ways, they are right? But so are women. There’s a deliberate push to destroy what it means to be a man, to destroy what it means to be a woman. 

And there’s just such a lack of nuance, I feel. And there’s this push for you’re only traditional if you stick up for men and you don’t speak on women’s issue, and you need to be pregnant and barefoot in the kitchen making a sandwich at all times. And I reject that entirely. I think that, you know, we can take some progress, right? There’s this fascination with the 1950s as if it was all good. And there were some, there’s some progress that we’ve had since the 1950s that we should keep. And we’ve gone, we, we’ve way overcorrected right to the fact, to the point that there’s this paradox of declining female unhappiness for both men and women too. So I think there’s just an overcorrection, and both sides are out of their minds at this point. 

What’s interesting is I had that beef with the Tate brothers, Andrew Tate and Tristan Tate the past couple weeks. And their minions, of course, come after me in my mentions, and I do read them because I think they’re pretty entertaining what they have to say. But one of their arguments, their arguments are non-substantive. What, because my observation, like I’m not talking about their legal case. I’m just making the moral case against Andrew Tate, that he does accurately diagnose a cultural ill that our society vilifies men. That’s true. And he’s correct about that. But then he prescribes essentially poison self-destruction for young men as an antidote to that, whether it’s materialism, pornography, exploitation of women, worship of self. Like that’s not what true masculinity is. And his minions come after me and call me a feminist because I am because I’m criticizing what they, what Andrew Tate tells them is masculinity. And I find that one of the most hilarious arguments because I think I’m probably like as close to an anti-feminist as you can get. 

Yeah. And I think there’s, look, you can’t blame ’em in a certain way because that’s almost all they have. I put out a tweet the other day, I said, who the best role model for men nowadays? And there really weren’t many substantive answers. There’s not really a figure or figures that men can look to. And I feel the same way about women that they can look to and say, this is masculinity, this is femininity. And so it’s becoming incredibly difficult. So it’s almost like, you know, you’re taking away their father figure in a way. So I understand, even though I don’t condone some of the outrage, I understand where it’s coming from. And this, again, this happened to me today when I said, this country has never been more hostile towards women and femininity and motherhood than it is right now. And men we’re losing their minds in the comments today saying, you know, what about men? 

Because they feel forgotten too. but there’s, we really need to step back what we’ve done. And I think a lot of this came from the sexual revolution that was being pushed by the Left. And we’ve just gone way too far. And many of these issues that they talk about, they wanna do a lot of quote unquote slut shaming, whatever you wanna call it. there is a responsibility on men for these issues too, right? Because these women are not sleeping with themselves. So they’re, you know, we really have to have an honest discussion about where we went wrong, because this isn’t working for anybody, for men or women. 

Well, it’s not mutually exclusive that there’s an assault on femininity and womanhood and an assault on males and masculinity. It seems pretty obvious that it’s been, that both have been happening for a long time. 


Well, it’s interesting. It’s interesting because to me, I mean, I’m a religious person. I’m a Christian, I’m a practicing Catholic. And this seems to me to be a spiritual problem, which I know this is a turnoff to a lot of Gen Z and millennials. I’m not actually sure how, and I’ve thought a great deal about this because I think the Republican Party as an apparatus is a complete failure. The only reason I’m even tangentially associated with them, and the only association I have is being a registered Republican. So I can vote in the Republican primary to try to pick the best fighter, but I think they’ve been a complete failure. And I’ve thought a lot about why they are such a failure and part of it’s corruption, part of it’s just seeking power and money. I mean, maybe the current R n C chair is a good example of that, or a terrible example of that. But truthfully, if I’m being honest, I think that the root of a lot of these problems is a spiritual crisis that we don’t understand what the true meaning of masculinity and femininity is, because that’s rooted in biblical values and you really can’t, you can’t define it secularly otherwise, you just get the chaos that we’re living in right now. 

I would agree. And I think it’s both, right? We are being screwed over in more ways than one by very, very powerful people who are anti humanists, antinatalists, you name it. They want the total destruction of society. They are just asking for civilization to collapse here. but I think it’s also, there’s a total lack of personal responsibility on us just being good people and doing what matters. And we want to point fingers at politicians and this and that, but we’re watching it, we call it a political circus all the time, as if they’re the monkeys and clowns dancing for us. But it’s really us. You know, we’re dancing for them, we’re making the fundraisers go, we’re making the fundraising emails go. We’re giving them the ratings, we’re putting our attention on them. The most valuable currency we have today is our attention. and so I would be very cautious about where you spend that currency because it is the most valuable. That’s what all of these things go on. That’s why data brokers are so valuable because the best thing they can get is your attention and into your psyche. So I think people need to be a little bit more conservative on where they spend their time, where they, what they’re paying attention to. 

Yeah, it’s almost like exercising self-control allows you to have a voice when you feel like you don’t have the capacity to fight back against the system. So my team is telling me that we have a really good answer. when you, when you tweeted, who’s the best modern role model for men regarding masculinity, this is an answer that you retweeted. So let’s bring this up on the screen so everyone can see. I don’t even know what this is. They just thought this is a good answer., 

What is it? What do we 

Got here? She, let’s bring this up if we can., what do we got? I had, 

There was a lot of people quote tweeting it. This is as as jokes. I think one of the bar stool guys quote tweeted it. 

Oh. Oh. Well, I don’t, I don’t know if that’s the one of the questions I, while they’re bringing that up, one of the questions under my, under my tweet was, why do you guys love the Tates so much? And I, as at first I was like, I assume he’s being sarcastic. And then I was like, wait a second. Do you, and I disagree on this because I think, I feel that the Tates are one of the most destructive influences on young men in modern history. And conservatives just like to brush those types of pop culture influences aside, like block them, ignore them. And I’m like, no, they’re forming the minds of young men. Of course we have to fight this cultural battlefield, but do we disagree on this or are we viewing this the same way? 

Well, I’ve never really spoken on the Tates, and I would disagree that conservatives ignore it. I see conservatives speaking about Andrew Tate all the time. You just said Candace Owens who did an interview with it. Obviously you guys had your spat. I just don’t think it’s the, I think Andrew Tate is a symptom, not the virus. And so I would rather speak to the issues that why did we get to this point? Why are men clinging to Andrew Tate? Why is this the version of masculinity? that is what I would rather focus on. Just personally, I have tried to stray away from this the pop culture aspect of idols and politicians. And if you notice, and people have followed me for a long time, I’ve really scaled back on even talking about politicians and the hyper political stuff because I think in a way we hyper fixate on that instead of focusing on issues. It just feels like another carrot. and I would rather speak about the root issues that we’re facing here. 

I don’t disagree with that. Actually. I agree that Andrew Tate is a symptom of the problem. I actually think that he’s emblematic of the problem that the Republican party has, where we are pretty good at pointing to something and saying, Hey, that’s wrong. Whether it’s drag queen story hour or critical race theory or sending money to Ukraine. But we don’t often know the definition of right as a movement and as a party. So we’re, we are the party of, no, actually, we, we very effectively say no. But then what do we offer as what’s right? And that’s exactly what Anate exactly 

Simplifies. So even, you know, Liz, even if you’re like, he’s the worst thing ever and he disappears tomorrow, then what? Right? And you truly believe that and he’s terrible for men, then what do you think men are gonna get better just because Andrew Tate goes away? Absolutely not. You know, they’re clinging to this for a reason and what is that reason? And there’s probably, you know, there’s good and bad aspects of that. And so I think people really need to dissect that because after Andrew Tate or before him, this was still very much brewing. 

Yeah, yeah. I don’t disagree with that. Okay. I think we finally have this retweet up on the screen here. If we can scroll, because I can only see the, okay, so you said, who’s the best modern role model man have for masculinity right now? 

Greg, if you guys dunno who Greg is. Greg is one of the best accounts on Twitter. you gotta follow him.. That is so is great. There were some really funny quote tweets on that. That is so me,, they turned a a serious post into a joke. on joke. 

One of my 


Tweet. That’s what Twitter, Twitter for. That’s why so many people hate on Twitter. They say that Twitter’s such a cesspool. And like, sure, you engage with the 

Trolls, it’s X you keep deadnaming. I know, 

That’s so hard. 

You’re a bigot. It’s mis 

It’s misgendering. 

You’re close. What we supposed to call 

It? One, it like posts though. 

It’s a post. 

Is it just posting? 

Yeah, you posted it. That doesn’t only 

Have the same MFAs tweeting though. 

Xed it. No, it doesn’t. Okay. But you know,, it was actually funny when I, my 50 year old hairdresser can get it right, Liz, he corrected me. I said Twitter, and he said, you mean X. So if he can get it right, we all can. Oh,, the boomers are the last hurts a little on change. they hate change. If they can do it, we can do it. Liz, 

I’m not one of those people. That was like extremely opposed to the change when he announced it. I know some people melted down, I’m just like ingrained in this habit and I’m like, I have a thousand things that are more important to think about and I haven’t like changed it in my mind yet. So one of the things about the your account is that I feel like probably on a weekly basis, if not more often, something that you post goes viral outside of conservative politics, outside of even politics in general spills completely into pop culture. And sometimes it’s something that’s really controversial and sometimes it’s something that people think is controversial but isn’t. What would you, what have you been surprised about when people have been outraged about your opinion aside from the birth control stuff? 

I would say the one that I got in the most trouble for recently was I said, I will never understand men’s obsession with sports. And this thing went viral, Liz. I mean, it was like 11,000 quote tweets, thousands of replies jokes on them. I got the ad reply money, okay, keep getting Mad Men. But there were articles about it saying, I outraged men. There was E S P N videos, everyone, it was a trend on TikTok to post my tweet and then their favorite sports clips, they absolutely lost their mind. So sometimes I think it just hits the right itch for them., they clinging to it. and I think it also helps that a lot of people can’t tell if my posts are satire or they’re serious. And I do that on purpose. I kind of blur those lines because I like creating the dialogue and discussion around the issues. I think it’s really important that we have open discussion. I think more people should be talking and more often. so I don’t really mind that they disagree with me, but I enjoy that it creates some sort of dialogue and at least gets people thinking. 

I think that’s called poking the bear. 

Yeah. Yeah. I’ll poke the bear all day long. Why are you as a man watching sports and not overthrowing the government? 

Listen, all you have to do to, to substantiate your point is post that clip that I could not avoid. I saw it like 500 times a couple days ago of Megan Rapinoe missing that, missing that penalty kick. Just post that and be like, see case closed. Done. Here we go., 

That’s probably the most, everyone making fun of that clip is probably the most, they’ve watched a women’s soccer in their whole life. So, 

You know what’s funny is I mean, I think a lot of, like a lot of millennials, I played soccer growing up. I played probably from the time I was eight through at least partway through high school. And I did used to watch the Women’s World Cup. But it is a turnoff. I don’t mean to sound like a boomer. It is a turnoff when these players become so overtly political because you do want to feel like a teammate, right? You want to feel like a supporter. You want to feel a connection to these players who are representing the country. And to me it is kind of a turnoff. Like I did not, I couldn’t quite bring myself to celebrate the us losing because after all, it is still like representing our country. But I totally get and understand why so many people were like, yes, you anti-American Americans lost. Like I do get that. 

Well you know what, this is probably gonna be the last time we have an all female women’s soccer team here in the United States. So that that’ll be the last time we have all biological females on the team, in my opinion., the men are gonna come in and we’ll find the win. Yeah, because Megan, 

They will and Megan Rapinoe won’t be affected at all. She said that trans trans people, meaning biological males should be welcome. Like right as she’s walking out the door, you can’t make that up. So who do you, who do you listen to on a daily basis? Like if you’re, I know you, we were talking just for a second before we went live here and you were saying that a lot of political topics shouldn’t even be discussed. It’s just pointless outrage. But who do you listen to or who do you rely on to? for political commentary, 

I don’t really listen to a lot of commentary. Like I will, sometimes I’ll read the news, like I’ll go on acts or I’ll read the Wall Street Journal or I’ll, you know, scroll Fox, I’ll scroll New York Times. I scroll it all to get my daily summary so I get a pulse check on what’s going on politically. But again, I try to stray away from it. Generally I just listen to audio books,, that might sound really dumb, but I usually just listen to audio books throughout my day as I’m listening to things on topics that are either culturally relevant in the moment or that I find interesting. Like I recently finished Louise Perry’s the Case Against the Sexual Revolution, which is a fantastic book, but I found it particularly relevant to another project that I’m working on and some of the discussion going on on my ex feeded and just culturally. So I typically just like to dive into the topics that are being discussed a little bit more. I’ll find out what’s going on and then try to immerse myself in it. 

Yeah, I do something similar. I often listen to podcasts that are like limited release, like a podcast that has like three or four or five or six episodes total. That’s about one topic. ’cause it’s, I mean it’s essentially an audio book just divided up into, into five things. So do you care at all about the Republican primary? Do you care at all about, not particularly the Trump versus DeSantis versus VA versus Vivek or like you have a horse 

Race? Not really. Nope. I I don’t, you know, obviously I think what’s happening to Trump right now is horrible. I think he’s effectively a political prisoner and I think people on both sides should be speaking out against what’s happening to President Trump right now. you know, the reality is that we don’t have transparency into our elections. I have no idea why. You know, if they wanna have these electronic voting machines, why not make the code open source? You know, why, why can we not have voter ID laws? there’s a lot wrong. but because I believe those things, I just have removed myself a little bit from the hyper political conversation. I think it’s very ugly what’s going on with a lot of these DeSantis versus Trump influencers. I’m not for that. I think that’s a total waste of time, at least for me. 

I don’t wanna deal with it if other people wanna be in that war, not judging them, but I just personally don’t wanna be involved. I think Vivek is saying some awesome things. He’s really, I don’t think we see candidates like him very often. He’s got a lot of charisma. He’s speaking to a lot of really important issues like BlackRock, like ESG like the lack of purpose we have. And I think that’s really, really important to speak on because if we don’t revive that purpose, we’re, we’re gonna go downhill very quickly. I think we really need to revive the American dream. We need to revive people having a sense of purpose. So I like the vague for speaking on those issues, but I just don’t wanna get into the weeds of all of it. 

Are you gonna watch the G o p primary in a couple weeks? 

I love the debate. Love the 


I love a good debate, so I will probably tune into that. But again, for the most part, unless it’s related to the Trump indictments or you know, the things I see here and there, I just don’t, but I will be watching the debate. 

I am gonna watch the debate because, not because I think that anything useful will be said. I think that it’s gonna be like a clown show for sure. I think there’s gonna be personal insults out the wazoo, and I’m just like there with my bingo card, seeing who, like who do you think will have the most hilarious, most cutting personal, not political, personal insult on that stage. Did 

Trump say he’s, is he doing the debate? I haven’t kept up. Is he doing it? 

He hasn’t said one way or the other. I don’t have inside knowledge about this, but I would bet a lot of money that he will show up if he 

Doesn’t. A hundred percent. He is one of the, he’s by far the funniest president we have ever had. He is just naturally hilarious. I think. I always think back to that clip. I always reference the clip of him with Kim Jong-Un and he says, is everyone looking nice and handsome and thin? And it pans over to Kim looking very obese. I think he’s just naturally funny. So it would have to be Trump, unfortunately, I don’t think the vague is very funny. I don’t think I’ve ever heard him laugh or say anything even remotely funny and then DeSantis we’ll see. but I think it would, hands down Trump would be the funniest. He’s naturally funny. 

I mean, I will, I’ll be disappointed if he’s not at this point given his track record, but I think it’s gonna be, I think it’s gonna be great. One of the most fun political moments in my memory is the 2016 primary when they were all up in the debate stage and it was just zinger after zinger, these personal insults that were apropos of nothing political, did not serve the the conservative Republican population to help people decide. And it was just like popcorn. Let’s watch the show. 

Yes, and I also, I loved watching Tulsi Gabbard murder Kamala Harris. That was one of the best moments in television history. 

It was. Unfortunately, I don’t think we’re gonna see a Democrat primary debate, although I think we agree that R F k Jr would handly defeat Joe Biden in that situation. Well, 

Let’s see if Newsom pops in, that would be entertaining. I don’t think I’ve seen him speak too much, especially in, you know, a debate setting. So I think that would be fun if Newsom ends up throwing his hat in the ring and we get to see that, 

Well, at least we’ll see the DeSantis Newsom debate. Not exactly sure what they’re debating. Hopefully it’s just like California versus Florida related to Covid, but apparently they’re debating. So I’m looking forward to that. tell me quickly about your book. So your book, when, if you Google your name, this is like one of the top hits, not just the book, but this controversial book that you wrote, what is so controversial about saying that elephants are not birds. 

So I wrote this book at the Height with brave books at the height of the, I guess it was the start, really, of a lot of this transgender craze for children. And so the book follows Kevin, the Elephant, and he’s an elephant who sings very well. And culture the vulture comes and says, well, Kevin, you sing so well, you must be a bird. And so Kevin tries living as a bird and it doesn’t work out too well. and he realizes that in order for him to be the best him he can be he’s better off as an elephant. So it’s really, it’s really about just, it seems like embracing who you are, you know, who God made you to be. so I don’t really think most of the people who wrote those hip pieces even read the book. And I continuously say that. 

I’m like, it’s about a singing elephant. you know, did you read it? But it’s about children. Really a lot of this, I think a lot of these trans issues are just identity issues, which are normal. Most kids have some sort of identity crisis as they’re growing up. It’s weird growing up, going through puberty. You know, you’re, it’s weird and people feel uncomfortable in their skin for a while, but that’s normal and that’s okay. And you may feel certain things, you may feel certain things that are more girlier, more boyish. I was a tomboy growing up, thank goodness I was not born in this time because God knows what would’ve happened. but it’s okay to have certain traits that are maybe a little more feminine or masculine. That doesn’t mean that you need to change who you innately are. 

Well, I think you just hit on why the book’s so controversial to the Left, because everything that you talked about is exactly what they are trying to reject. They’re actively trying to instill the identity crisis in children instead of help shepherd them through it. everyone, you should go get this book. You should read it to your kid, obviously, because this is the normal stuff that you want your kid to grow up believing. Ashley St. Clair, thanks for coming on the show. This was so fun chatting. 

Thank you, Lance. Have a good day. 

Okay, and everyone go to her Twitter account. It is St. Clair Ashley, s t c l a i r Ashley I mean, it’s not her Twitter. What am I saying? Clair Ashley. Oh goodness. This is gonna be like, I need to go to reeducation camp or something to get the, to get the word Twitter outta my head for good. Some kind of like swear jar situation Clair Ashley. Okay, we’ll talk to you guys soon. Thank you for watching today. Thank you for listening. I’m Liz Wheeler. This is the Liz Wheeler Show. 


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